via Defense News
WARSAW — The Czech Ministry of Defense aims to order 20 Pandur II 8x8 armored personnel carriers (APCs) from General Dynamics European Land Systems. The deal is expected to be awarded in July, Czech Deputy Defense Minister Jiri Borovec said.We're seeing it again.
The new APCs will improve the military's command and communication capability, Borovec told local news agency CTK.
"The [supplied] vehicle should not differ significantly from the rest [of the Czech APCs]. And not only visually, but also in terms of their tactical-technical specification," said Gen. Petr Pavel, the chief of the General Staff of the Czech Armed Forces.
The Pandurs will belong to the military's 4th Rapid Reaction Brigade.
The planned contract will expand the APC fleet operated by the Czech Army. In March 2009, the country's government approved the purchase of 107 Pandur II vehicles for 14.4 billion crowns (US $609 million). The APCs were designed to replace the Czech military's outdated OT-64 armored vehicles, which were jointly developed by then-communist Poland and Czechoslovakia in the 1960s.
A small nation is standardizing on one vehicle, developing a family of vehicles from it and I believe will save money without losing combat capability in the process.
The Pandur II seems like a good vehicle, I wonder why it hasn't achieved greater export success.
General Dynamics owns both the Piranha/LAV line AND the Steyr Pandur line so it often loses in competition prior to there even being a bid. Plus, there have been some corruption charges leveled at Steyr back in the late 90s about the Czech competition so who knows.
ReplyDeleteSteyr Pandur is an inferior product compared to AMV and lost in all head to head competitions for good reason ,czech tender was won with help of kickbacks.
ReplyDeleteAnd that Israeli fold down turret promised great firepower but couldn't hit a barn door on our army trials so kongsberg turrets had to be installed instead for much more $$$
ReplyDeleteinteresting, do you have a link to an article on that or something?
Deleteon topic
is the IFV on tracks dead or something?
these "modern" IFVs on wheels are just APCs, what's the deal, i don't get it, APCs also have turrets, they're not school buses....
IFVs have tracks for a purpose....
Info on that turret is direct knowledge first we had problems with Elbit ORCWS 30 haitting anything ,then Rafael Samson RCWS-30 had troubles with spike integration in any case we ended up with Kongsber turrets that cost more even tough they only carry 0.5 cal it at least these were hiting their targets.we can only hope we ever find funding for Kongsberg Protector 30 . We have been buying Israeli made weapons for decases but you have to know that much of the Israeli gear is cheap shit not comparable to German,French or Skandinavian products sometimes is worse than Russian gear,but as said is much much cheaper. If you have good budged avoid Elbit and Rafael stuff .
Deletek, thanks, my country is really into israeli stuff but i guess is for economic reasons, which is even worse..waste of already limited resources
Deletewait a sec. Mr T might be a fine fellow but he's rabidly anti-Israel and his characterization of this weapon system is a bit misplaced. first the Israeli's were the first to develop an unmanned (in the modern day) 30mm RWS. additionally they're the first to have one that was "mast" mounted which gave a much better field of view but they didn't stop there. they designed it to be foldable so that it would maintain strategic transportability across a variety of platforms.
Deleteit was first in class and had issues. Mr T is additionally comparing first gen systems with 2nd or even 3rd gen that are being developed by competitors. the Israelis don't produce junk. there stuff is affordable because they desire to sell and they have a robust homegrown defense research industry.
long story short. consider the source before you make a judgement about a particular manufacturer trash....even when its me shouting.
sure they have great stuff, but one product delivering less performance can happen to anyone, BECAUSE is a low budget solution, i understand that.
Deletethe problem is when you pay premium and you get crap
Sorry but in this case knowledge in first hand .
DeleteElbit RCWS 12,7mm and 30mm failed accuracy tests on AMV in 2008 singe shot accuracy was kinda ok up to 400m but past that or in burst or full auto fire it couldnt hit barn door . Like said Kongsberg RCWS in 12.7 was chosen instead and Rafael 30mm spike combo to replace Elbit but at least at the time 2008 Spike integration was far from perfect.
So far every thing we bought from Elbit was medicore quality at best,dangerous at worst one of the new Soltam M71 155mm howitzers blew up killing one and wounding 2 ,howitzers lack some modern safety features that are standard in modern howitzers and charge ignited before breech was completely closed.,Soltam 120mm mortars were found to contain surplus parts some 30+ years old years old) Rafael is a bit better only piece of kit that was without problem so far is Super Dvora patrol boat ,by the way we had problems with Kongsberg as well but not because they didn't work but because in testing 2-3 units were found to be refurbished and not brand new like they were sold and paid for.
I stand by most Israeli stuf being affordable but also medicore in quality and preformance - in the end you get what you pay for.
In an case our militar and politicians liked to buy in Israel as firstly things were cheap enough secondly Isrealis always had a nice kick back package to go along the contract.
And like you said you can pay premium and get crap , that was the case with our purchase of Roland II SAM system, thing might be German and was hot in the 70s but in 21st century is just and huge and slightly mobile SAM system with short range and low lethality.
don't care what you're saying here because i've seen too much to be swayed by your supposed evidence. additionally saying that elbit is inferior is not borne out. RWS systems are just a small bit of what they produce. you will find gear with their name on it in all modern allied armies.
Deletebut we can agree to disagree. what i find interesting is that you failed to address what i considered my biggest jab at you. you're a good guy but vehemently anti-Israel.
i think your lack of response to that charge says it all.
anti-Israel Hmm. Maybe, probably? Have been great fan of the IDF in the past but ,IDF kinda went from being a kick ass military that fought off invading armies too being a force of oppression and Israel created ''open air prisons '' like you could only dream about in the past, sort of modern day Warsaw ghetto or Snake Plissken NY combine that with land grabs and settlements meant to weaken Palestinian chances of a statehood as in time there will be no land left and i have to say its very hard to see Israel as the force for good in this world.
Deleteonce again we disagree. how can you coexist with a people that want to destroy you? how can you support a people that condone and support terrorism? how can you hate a people (Israel) that is fighting simply for survival and has already given up land that it conquered from Arabs that sought to finish Hitlers plan for the Jewish solution?
Deletesorry i see the Palestinians as pushing an agenda of terrorism, having leaders that make corruption look like a way of life and are doing any and everything to sabotage the peace process that has been attempted by more US officials than is warranted.
I've seen Rafael 25mm OWS on M-113s, those were damn accurate in the hands of people who knew what they were doing. This was 3 decades ago mind you.
DeleteMr.T, sometimes the only time I think Israel can get along with Palestine is if they totally depopulated the place. Leave the Palestinians alone and see what happens. Rockets in your back yard. You can't even leave them alone if you wanted to, they will come and harass YOU.
I'm sort of going in the opposite direction from you. I used to be sympathetic to the Palestinians, but it's obvious that their violence strategy isn't working out, yet they are stuck on that as the only solution. They simply can't see that they are into limited returns.
Unrelated news, not sure I agree with the US Army, sounds to me like this will lead to more of a downgrade of PT than an upgrade to requirements, hope the USMC stays away from this idea.....
ReplyDeletehttp://www.military.com/daily-news/2015/01/06/army-looking-at-new-mos-specific-pt-tests.html?ESRC=todayinmil.sm